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23 Jan 2024 18:17:08
I watched the game on TV this afternoon.
First let's address the ref and the Cunha issue/yellow card. Whilst it would undoubtedly be a total waste of time appealing it was clearly a horrendous error/piece of work by the ref!
Although the ref in the second half was ok in the first half he was awful and sadly let Brighton make a fool of him.
I had always assumed Brighton played lovely stuff and were super exciting.
What I didn't realise was how versed in the darker arts they are now under Zebri (sp)
In the first couple of minutes Estupian (sp) body checked a Wolves player to stop a fast break - free kick but no booking! Over the next 40 minutes Gilmour did this 4 times! Not once was a free kick given - presumably the ref didn't see as it wasn't the man on the ball he brought down but a supporting runner - in each case Cunha.
Perhaps hard to criticize the ref, who presumably didn't see the fouls, but the linesman and VAR must have - indeed Jenas, who pinned his Brighton colours to the mast pretty early on, commented on the 3rd that it was a clear foul but Cunha over played the contact (?) - so what were they doing?Whatever you think of today and today's ref we do though have a serious problem with refs and the bookings, (and presumably eventually suspensions), continue to mount up. Given the size of our squad this may hurt us.
Overall, despite Brighton having most of the ball and territory, a point was a little disappointing with Wolves having by far the better chances. Note however I would have taken it in a flash before the game.
Ratings Sa 7 - Had a calm afternoon and made everything look easy - some of it wasn't. Still not sure why so many Wolves fans don't rate him?
Doherty 7 - Didn't get forward as much as he normally does - presumably under instructions - but was solid at the back.
Toti 7 - Played well. Didn't look flustered or hurried despite the pressure Brighton applied at times.
Dawson 7 - Dominated the box and was strong. Showed good leadership. Not sure why he was booked.
Kilman 7 - Like Dawson was very strong. Both made countless blocks
Semedo 8 - Excellent defensively. Given our set up didn't do much going forward.
Doyle 8 - Worked v hard and made lots of challenges but was also calm and progressive on the ball
Lemina 7 - He was poor in the first half but got better and better as he worked his way into the game T . Great Engine!
Sarabia 6 - Pace of the game was hard for him but did ok
Cunha 6 - Missed a few chances and wasn't quite at his best, probably upset by the injustice done to him. Needs to put it behind him and we need to ensure that the refs going forward are made aware of what the opposition are doing illegally!
Neto 8 - So close to being a superstar. It would have taken very little for him to have been the match winner. Given he has only just come back from injury (again) I am really hopeful that we have a genuine star in our ranks - DO NOT SELL!
Subs
Bellegard 6 - Didn't really get into the game
Chirewa N/A Albeit on a brief performance showed maturity and discipline when called upon.
Flat marks across the team demonstrate just what a solid performance this was.
We are midtable but at the moment I'm looking up not down!
1.) 23 Jan 2024 20:10:34
As always very much appreciated Thefutureisoldgold, An excellent post/read.
2.) 23 Jan 2024 20:31:50
Note it was stated Cunha was booked for constant infringements but when he was booked I am not sure he had actually committed a single foul?
In the move pre the booking however Cunha and Gilmour came together twice.
Fistly Cunha challenged Gilmour who went down and at full speed it looked like a foul but on the replay it was clear that Cunha played the ball and in fact not only was there no contact but there was at least 12 inches of clear air between them. Gilmour went down - fell over/dived - but regardless the ref seemingly and correctly gave nothing?
A few moments/passes later Wolves having won the ball were again breaking and Cunha was attempting to get up in support. Once again Gilmour aware of the danger ran over and shoulder charged him to the ground - a clear foul. Cunha was then booked.
Unsurprisingly he was unhappy and at half time you can lip read him talking to the linesman coming off saying "he fouled me". He obviously believed he had been booked for being fouled by Gilmour who was set on ensuring Cunha could not join in the Wolves attack.
The refs statement that it was for persistent infringments and the booking itself would be laughable were it not so serious!
3.) 23 Jan 2024 21:37:26
When Cunha was booked it was described as ridiculous by Mikey. Tommo and Tom King. The sad part is there will be no consequences for the referee and his assistants they seem to be untouchable. It's time that changed. it won't though mainly because there isn't enough of them available to cover all the matches.
4.) 24 Jan 2024 08:37:47
Thanks Future, I listened to the commentary but your assessment gives a fuller picture.
5.) 24 Jan 2024 16:25:55
For me Sarabia gave the ball away too easily and didn’t look comfortable.
There’s talk (click bait)? Of selling him on and looking at a winger from Sunderland (Clarke?).
Any thoughts?
6.) 24 Jan 2024 19:21:57
Jack Clarke, young winger/forward, quick, two footed and performing well in the Championship. Question is, can he make the step up?
7.) 25 Jan 2024 11:21:45
In reply to the above if Jack Clarke could make the step up, Chquinho has already proven that he can and he won't cost us anything!
8.) 25 Jan 2024 15:12:48
The young lad from Ipswich - Chirewa (sp) also looked completely comfortable albeit for only a few minutes at the end of the game.
Since GON brought him on one can only assume he is confident in him as well?
9.) 26 Jan 2024 07:17:33
Hi TFIG, yes I agree GON has done a good job with him in training getting him comfortable playing with the seniors and making him feel like he belongs on the pitch with them, looks calm on the ball.
06 Jan 2024 12:04:59
There is currently lots of noise about Neto's future at Wolves with a growing acceptance that he will leave in the summer, normally with Arsenal as the destination.
What is less clear however is the "value" that Wolves will obtain.
I have heard figures ranging from £30m to £80m mentioned with outliers at £100m + {Note his injury record is often mentioned as the reason for the "low" figures}
For Wolves however the problem is though how do you replace him not just for the fee (whatever it is you receive) or the wages but in terms of players who will come to Wolves (geography and football status).
I therefore get to thinking who would be capable, (even if not willing), of replacing him 1 for 1 in the Wolves team.
Note many players might have similar or even better stats, (actually far fewer do if you include assists and not just goals where he is actually a bit "light"), but if those stats are achieved in more favourable circumstances are they as solid?
So restricting yourself to players who currently play in the Prem who are you confident could come in and do a similar job for Wolves.
Once you have your list, (I assume you have a v short one), think what those players' clubs would demand for their man and that is what Wolves need to receive for Neto!
That outlier doesn't look so silly now does it!
{Ed002's Note - Pedro Neto (RW/LW) Versatile and looking to move on. Agent has been approached by Manchester United, who will need an Antony replacement, and Arsenal. It is unclear why Wolves are so kee and they clearly have other priorities, but they are. Juventus fear losing young left-footed RW in Matias Soule and may look to Neto. May be wanted in the Middle East which would push his value up. I would expect Wolves to as perhaps £50M for him.}
1.) 06 Jan 2024 12:48:30
I recent interview I heard by a Football finance expert was that Arsenal, Villa, Newcastle, Forest and Palace were all in danger of breaching FFP as they have spent big money on new players but not received as much for outgoing players. Arsenal have spent big on White, Partey, Rice, Odegaard and Jorginho in the latest FFP cycle and this is why they could only sign Raya on loan. If the sign Toney for £100m as well as Raya for £45m, then they will have to move some players on to facilitate any move for Neto.
We were linked with a young Portugese winger last week. Maybe he is the replacement for Neto. It is all guesswork at the moment but the good news is that we looked good recently when Neto was available so maybe GON is happy for him to move on for a big fee so that he can add more depth to the squad.
2.) 06 Jan 2024 16:07:19
Ed 002 and Jas thank you for two sensible responses. Jas you make valid points re Arsenal and depth - although not sure depth is easy to get right.
Given how hard I believe it will be to replace him (see below) and the fact that our FFP problens are now largely under control - still think we will need to be sensible this Jan but hopefully there will be a little wriggle room in the summer even without a major sale - I am as Ed 002 says unsure why Wolves are seemingly "keen" or even willing to countenance a sale?
I was hoping for a list of names from you guys of Premiership players who could replace him. Maybe you think he is irreplaceable? However, to encourage you, I will kick off.
I went through the mids on Fantasy football and identified those whose points per min were in line with Neto (ok not a perfect comparison but at least not subjective) and then eliminated those that played in a more central or defensive role but who, perhaps because they take pens, are up there. I then also eliminated the big team's players Salah, Son, Saka, Gordon, Doku, Foden etc.
This left:
Bowen and Kudus at WH, Olise and Eze at CP, Elanga at Forest, Mitoma at Brighton, Mbuemo at Brentford or Bailey or Diaby at Villa. How many of these can you realistically see coming to Wolves - maybe Elanga, (who I actually suggested as a Fabio option when United bought him for pennies a few years ago), but probably a round number?
Also, admittedly with my biased eye, I only really would want Bowen or Mitoma on a 1 for 1 basis, i.e. I would want to have cash left over aFter signing any of the others?
Thoughts or alternatives?
3.) 06 Jan 2024 18:36:59
Neto is unique as his runs direct and defenders and the quality of ball at the is normally up there.
Although some of these players have been in good form.
I would say Neto is similar to Jota before he left in that he is one of if not the best of the rest. And he would make a difference at a big side.
So for that reason I think he is worth more than £50m the others would be sold for £70m+.Why not Neto?
In terms of replacements it's tricky as the club have tried to bring in numerous players over the past 6 years.
When we played Chelsea they had Badiashiale and Madeuke who would have developed like Neves, Jota and Neto much better than they will at Chelsea.
But. Selling Wolverhampton a sthe place to play is hard.
4.) 06 Jan 2024 18:51:26
For me, if Neto does go, we don't need to rush out and replace him. Bellegarde and Hwang can play either side and we have Gonzalez currently adapting to English football and so he should be ready soon. Some players I would like and think can be a success with us are Dwight McNeil, Dwight McNeil and Jack Harrison.
5.) 06 Jan 2024 22:53:00
Madman - v good post
Jas Dwight Mcneil is a v good shout. However Jas I think Neto is a class above both the 2 Wolves players you mention, even Hwang in his undeniably purple patch, so whilst I agree they could play in those areas - in fact have done - I'm not sure that it wouldn't be a drop off in quality for Wolves
The mention of Chelsea does though show how hard it is to put a cash price on it - they paid over £80m for Mudryk (sp) who is not even in the same postal district as Neto - but others, like Mitoma, were signed for pennies, allegedly £3m in Mitoma's case, albeit before he was established in the Prem like Neto is?
For me Wolves won't be able to replace him 1 or 1 so as Jas says we will need to do a deal or two to add depth. However that comes fraught with difficulty.
For every good deal there are numerous bad ones and once you sell Neto you can't go back.
Ask Southampton they sold Shearer to add depth and got Speedie and Dixon seemingly a great idea 2 top players for one - but Shearer goes onto be a legend and the other 2 disappear without trace. Closer to home look how we spent the Robbie Keane money - badly! Or more recently the Jota money!
If at all possible I wouldn't sell but look to build the team around him, Cunha, Lemina and Gomes.
I believe that we are on the right road and that we don't need revolution just slow evolution.
Only Dawson needs replacing in the short term and our growth therefore can be from a position of some strength?
6.) 07 Jan 2024 17:10:10
I forgot Man U bought Anthony for over £80m as well. So 2 players not fit to lace Neto's boots bought for over £80m each?
7.) 09 Jan 2024 07:01:09
If Neto played for Brighton or Brentford he would be worth £100m so why are Wolves players always undervalued. Even if the mentioned teams overvalue their players, they still get it!
8.) 09 Jan 2024 09:34:13
Adeee - hard to argue. Neves "only" fetched £40m from Saudi but after a few months evidence he looks a far better bet than Enzo or Caicedo (sp) at Chelsea both of whom cost over £100m. Having said that Rice who looks better than all 3 again went for just over £100m
Maybe we over rate our players or maybe we missed a trick in not engaging Chelsea or Man United who seem to be the outliers in overpaying?
08 Oct 2022 22:24:11
ps forgot to mention that although several of the team stood and applauded the fans only Traore - who had been subbed off and thus was sitting on the bench on half way at the final whistle got up and walked to the fans - where he gave away his shirt and signed some autographs. Classy during and after the game!
1.) 09 Oct 2022 08:03:22
Your report and player ratings Thefutureisoldgold in team and matches section.
?
2.) 09 Oct 2022 08:46:23
Just watching us on MOTD Thefutureisoldgold and saw the quality of Adama beat his man and cross for Whang who miss hit his shot it was perfect cross on a plate.
Whang take away the h and g and replace with another letter.
3.) 09 Oct 2022 10:11:56
Ps whang I mention for his miss yesterday.
I think he guedes and other players all have some quality it's a confidence thing I think.
Nunes I saw had an excellent run nearly the full length of the pitch and guedes fouled with the Chelsea player receiving a booking.
4.) 09 Oct 2022 10:16:13
Hwang is not a PL footballer, he started out well but petered out. Sell him to Leeds in January.
5.) 09 Oct 2022 10:16:51
Phil, that was just one moment in game, Hwang ran his socks off and chased every ball down, he could of done a bit better once or twice, but he was far from being bad, Costa, Podense, Nunes,Guedes all had good chances to get shots away,but either over played it or passed ball instead.
6.) 09 Oct 2022 10:28:56
Nice 1 Sydney ?
I redeemed myself as was wrong to judge on one miss that's all I was going on.
7.) 09 Oct 2022 10:49:39
Guedes is a waste of money.hwang aswell.nunes mite come good.but silly moneybwas spent on these players when we needed a quality fwd.lage has decimated our squad.i said wed be bottom after 10games with5points.not2far away.too many happyclappers out ther who couldnt/wouldnt see what was happening.lopetigui has been a good manager and should bring plenty of experience.but its time to break this portugese monopoly up.and the likes of jonny and motinhio need to be replaced along with jiminez aswell
8.) 09 Oct 2022 12:02:11
Tye happy clappers as you put it Bux is for me just wanting our team to do well.
Was the same in lower leagues in 80's growing up.
It never leaves me the thrill excitement of being wolves.
You are of course correct in your predictions as where we are now.
Regarding all.our players imo it's getting them to play to their abilities and as a team.
I have hope we will turn things around.
9.) 09 Oct 2022 13:14:09
Bux I was thinking similar regarding the Portuguese project maybe it's time to focus less on Portuguese talent and spread our wings more.
As for your happy clapper comment no need for it we just want the team to do well and we get behind the players.
10.) 09 Oct 2022 14:46:03
Tks Phil - his cross for Nunes was an even better chance - really Nunes has to score but doesn't. Sydney don't disagree re Hwangs work rate or your comment on us getting shots away - Costa in particular always seemed to miscontrol it or fail to get it out of his feet.
Bux obviously much of what you say I agree with although I think you know the problems are more complex and deep than maybe your posts lead people to think you believe.
Re Lage he obviously didn't help himself with some bizarre tactics/selections but given the issues in the squad/club his hand was somewhat forced.
Yesterday we only had 11 fit first 11 quality players but 3 are FBs so Toti had to play and I'm including Guedes - who currently looks hopeless, Costa who clearly isn't fit, Moutinho who shouldn't be playing 90 mins week in week out and Otto who hasn't yet recovered ( will he ever) from his injuries - in that 11. Not a great lot of choices there then in either selection or in reality tactics as 4,2,3,1 was pretty much the only line up they could play.
Indeed did Lage even get fired because he was losing games or because he effectively openly criticised Jeff with his failure to pick Toti (on the evidence of yesterday a correct decision mind!).
He like Nuno had clearly stated the squad was too small and openly stated he wanted amongst other things more senior CBs - in fact he wanted 2 players for each position in the squad!
Thus picking Neves was a direct challenge to Shi!
His pre sacking comments after the WH game on never losing when he had a first choice CF may in fact be correct I don't know but is also a totally unsubtle dig at Jeff.
He therefore, like Nuno, had to go regardless of the results.
Having gone from Champions league contenders after Seville (indeed even last Feb!) to now 2 years later relegation candidates if not favourites despite having spent circa £200m in the transfer market and hugely increasing the wage bill this surely indicates a genuine problem exists in the club far greater than the travails of Lage.
Who ever comes in now has a massive job on their hand and will need to spend v serious money in Jan to keep us up.
Who ever it is must be allowed to manage the club in the way both Nuno and Lage clearly stated it had to be run and Shi must have zero involvement - other than signing the cheques - from now on!
If you think this is going to be expensive - wait till you see what relegation costs!
11.) 09 Oct 2022 15:07:41
Fair comment.me too.was aimed at those that just refuse to see.and another thing. Am sick of podences stupid little flicks n tricks that never come off.he needs2grow up.coz he isn't all that.idiot
12.) 09 Oct 2022 17:04:31
Actually Sa also went over to the fans and gave his shirt to one, there is a video on Twitter.
13.) 09 Oct 2022 17:22:33
So Future your saying we got our shots away? because where I was sat, it was far from it, we got into good positions but la keep the confidence to get the shot away, instead 1 touch puch too many loosing possession or passing the ball, I agree with Costa comment, Hwang chased every ball around him, he's just turned into another scapegoat for the fans.
Some of the comments from so called fans in the away end are a discrace,yes they pay their money, but they are nothing but poison, that was my 10 years sons first away game and I felt sorry for him to listen to some of the rubbish at the final whistle.
14.) 09 Oct 2022 17:38:24
No Sydney I agree with you we didn't get our shots away!
Rated - I was there and didn't see that but if you have seen it on a video apologies to you and Sa!
15.) 09 Oct 2022 18:12:36
No apology needed thefuture mate I only originally saw Traore go to fans on tv, it was only when someone uploaded the video showing Sa going over too I knew Sa had.
16.) 09 Oct 2022 20:15:40
My apologies Future, I just read it back again with my glasses on this time, something I'm still getting used to.
17.) 10 Oct 2022 06:42:17
I was there on Saturday as well and thought though playing a superior side, we worked hard and rode our luck until the first goal.
TFOG summarises our woes very succinctly.
Saturday even more difficult due to the new manager unlikely to be with us by then.
This is a disaster 3 seasons in the making. The sacking of Dalrymple in 2019 was a seriously bad decision, compounded by Shi taking over the day-to-day running of the Club.
Now we have gone from having well-balanced squad to a dis-functional group.
Until Fosun realise their investment is at serious risk, we will continue to decline.
18.) 10 Oct 2022 06:51:03
Forest palace leicester next3up.should all be winable.but if not then wer in deep trouble whoever the manager is
19.) 10 Oct 2022 10:41:30
Not with the players currently at our disposal,Bux (Neves excepted). For games to be winnable we have to score and it's long odds on that we won't score in at least one of those games and it's odds on that we'll concede in all three. And there's our problem
20.) 10 Oct 2022 17:42:26
If Costa is going to have some fun it has to be with Leicester Forest Palace next up.
Thefutureisoldgold's banter posts with other poster's replies to Thefutureisoldgold's banter posts
22 Jul 2024 13:34:46
There have been lots of posts regarding Fosun and their financial commitment to Wolves recently and as someone who has in the past been critical of aspects of their ownership I think it is only fair to try and present a balanced view.
It is a fact that they took us up and have kept us up now for several years.
This is not only something we had previously failed to do, despite the millions of Sir Jack, but also, other than a dozen or so sides - most of whom have hundreds of millions pounds a year more of revenue than us - no one else has.
Today 72 sides in the Championship and below would love to swap places with us!
However despite initially supporting us strongly and in our hour of need (when relegation loomed!) coming to our aid again it is I believe, also fair to say that we have not been consistently well managed financially.
We lost over £100m before player sales last year!
We had the transfer market debacle during the 2 years post Seville when we signed amongst others Fabio, Hoever, Trincao, William Jose and Guedes. All totally insane transfers which those of you who have been on this site for a few years will know I was highly critical of at the time!
We have failed to build commercial revenues, despite the Portuguese, Mexican and now Korean angles!
But we also have a wage bill totally out of kilter with our football activities.
I have asked this question before and got no responses at all so hoping for better this time.
How can we have a wage bill of over £140m when we have a small and modestly paid squad - estimates are certainly no higher than £60m? Agent fees, payoffs to ex managers, cleaners on £100k each?
Thoughts?
1.) 22 Jul 2024 14:20:16
Wernt trincao and jose loans and hoever was part of the jota deal.the big mistake was not investing after the 1st ssn in prem and continuing with a small squad which nuno liked working with.wenever in prem history did a team keep the same side for11 straight games.fast fwd to lage and not ridding him after that 1st ssn leads us to wer we are.some would argue wer where we should be or deserve to be but with wiser investment we could be a side that is challenging for top6/8 and finish ther and not end up in 13/14 place
2.) 22 Jul 2024 14:36:57
I don’t know the answer tbh, but wondering where you get your figures from. After looking up premier league wages all I could find was an article with a list of the various clubs wages and we came in 17th which doesn’t seem to bad to me. I don’t know the actual figures or who gets paid what etc so am in no position to answer your question.
3.) 22 Jul 2024 14:45:40
I think the person making the most noise about Fosun only occasionally pops up with the same comments and is clearly on a wind-up (check previous posts/comments).
Fosun has achieved more with wolves than any other owner in decades. Sure, they haven't been perfect and dropped a ball or two. But they appear to be cleaning up from their previous mistakes, and trying to implement a better strategy.
4.) 22 Jul 2024 15:19:08
Fordhouse - agree! The last 18 months or so have seen a real turnaround! Hence as I stated in a post a few days ago I am reasonably positive we can look up not down fom last season.
Subject of course to buying a new CB and not selling any of our best players!
Goatmark - Wolves accounts, which are publicy available. Yes we do have a modest wage bill for the football side but sadly not for something else - I don't know what!
Bux - yes re Trincao, Jose and Hoever. Not sure about the squad size. Nuno stated he wanted a bigger squad after Seville so they sold Jota to partially finance the purchase of Fabio and Hoever!
5.) 22 Jul 2024 15:26:53
We are well supported in S Korea, Mexico and Portugal. Not as well as other clubs with a bigger pedigree than us but still big.
I know that Man Utd do a travel package for overseas fans which is massive. Liverpool do the same.
One of my colleagues is based in S Korea and he tells me that after Hueng Min Son, Hwang is worshipped over there.
6.) 22 Jul 2024 16:10:34
I would say that on balance Fosun's ownership has been positive the downsides have been in their lack of knowledge in running a football club. They have made mistakes in their time in charge but I would say that at last they now have a hierarchy that could prove to be a success in the way the club is run.
I must admit I was a bit surprised at the 140m pounds wage bill and I wonder where it goes, can't see the first team squad costing more than 65-70m per year. I know that we have a lot of coaches cascading down the age groups but they can't account for where the other millions go to. Probably have to ask Jeff but not likely to get an answer I would have thought! The costs of running the club must be massive, just looking at the last few weeks for example. First team squad in Marbella flying out on a jet charter this year whereas last year they flew Ryanair. The only reason I know is my interest in aviation. We also had two age groups in Bratislava again quite costly I would imagine. Though again that cost doesn't come from the wages budget. All I can suggest as to where it goes if Jeff must have big pockets (joke)
At the moment I hope they get GON to sign a new contract get rid of certain players and bring a few more and I'll be very happy with the way Fosun a running the club. It's taken a while but I think we are back to just prior to Seville. We've just lost a few years!
.
7.) 22 Jul 2024 16:18:38
Maybe there are a lot of South Koreans walking around Seoul in their new Sudu shirts as haven’t seen anyone wearing one in Wolverhampton.
Is this due to the solidarity of fans who said they would renew their season tickets but not buy any merchandise?
8.) 22 Jul 2024 16:19:51
I see your point Tfiog, maybe there’s just a lot of well paid staff. I guess knowing how it compares to other clubs might help. If it is comparable then I guess all good if not then I guess maybe some are right and Jeff is paying himself too much.
9.) 22 Jul 2024 16:23:31
What no reply to the responses to your last post E?, just more criticism toward the club.
10.) 22 Jul 2024 18:50:51
I've seen a few of the new shirts being worn.
11.) 22 Jul 2024 19:27:42
Was that on your summer holiday to Seoul WS because they’re not around Wolverhampton and unlikely to be with the match day prices announced by the club today.
Locals are unhappy with the prices and supporters of many years are standing by their vow to renew season tickets but not spend in the club megastore.
12.) 22 Jul 2024 20:40:37
Yep. Saw a few people wearing the new top this morning.
13.) 22 Jul 2024 20:49:54
I can't go to the Chelsea game as I'm away but although I'm not happy about it, I'll buy Newcastle and Liverpool tickets and then using the 10% ticket cash, purchase my Man City and Palace tickets using whatever cash I've earned to make it cheaper
14.) 23 Jul 2024 08:40:25
i still don't trust them a inch guys
15.) 23 Jul 2024 11:46:56
How much did we pay nuno lage and lopetgui tfig? Does this in any way contribute to the 'wages' bill?
16.) 23 Jul 2024 14:34:49
Just found a table of staff costs and we are around 12-14th roughly the same as other clubs and not much more than the bottom clubs. So doesn’t seem to be anything suspicious to my eyes. Guess 160mil is just how much it costs to pay everyone involved at the club.
17.) 22 Jul 2024 16:03:12
Wandering - last year we made £26m from everything Korea, Mexico, Portugal, India, New Zealand, Mongolia, USA, you name it and Wolverhampton! So whilst i don't have the details I would imagine the numbers you are talking about are miniscule.
But I guess as the advert says "every little helps" and maybe going forwards it will be different it needs to be!
18.) 26 Jul 2024 07:03:34
From what I've red are wage bill is between40 and 50 mill nowhere near 160 mill.
10 Jun 2024 21:54:37
Old Wulf
You are completely correct!
With Dawson we are 35 from 25 plus a few more from Var - so again edge of Europe
Without 11 from 13 - relegation battle/relegated!
Note their, (Neto and Dawson), games do largely overlap so hard to be definitive about who adds the value but without Neto we immediately don't score as many points but when Dawson goes as well our point collection all but disappears. Some logic there - Neto wins games. Dawson stops you from losing them
I must admit I excluded Dawson from my top 5 players in the squad that should be off limits for sales primarily on the basis that he is old and may now, following his injury, be on borrowed time. I guess I also don't believe that, despite his superb form over the last 12 months, we would get any significant offers for him and so - rather like the Lemina story - why on earth would we sell him?
I may be being a bear and he could give us another year helping guide Kilman and develop Toti but for me the 3 CBs are probably my number 1 area that needs strengthening in the first 11 and are fairly high up for improvement in depth.
Hence a little surprised at the signing - if it is a signing - of an inexperienced RWB for over £10m (for us this is likely to be a lot of money unless we either do something very stupid like sell one of our 5 superstars or we get very lucky and someone makes a silly offer for someone else - Sa or Kilman at over 40 a pop would be amazing)
Unless Semedo is leaving - again I don't think you will get much if any fee for him so why sell just to remove the wages, albeit large, of someone who may be the 6th, 7th or 8th best player we have - Gomes (R) is likely to be a back up RWB ahead of Doherty and Hoever ( if either remain). With all the other issues we are facing this seems to be a luxury that I'm not sure we can afford.
Although if he is as good as many are saying he is a very positive signing both for the future (when Semedo - who is after all old and in the last year of his contract - moves on/retires) and now as a back up/alternative if Semedo gets injured, suspended or loses form etc etc.
2 quality players in every position should be the mantra for all well run clubs - but we aren't a well run club and need to cut our cloth accordingly.
We do need at least 1 new GK - (hopefully Sa - again our 6th, 7th or 8th best player but old and seemingly in demand for silly money ( please!) - may leave, meaning we need 2) The chap from Liverpool looks an obvious and cheap replacement for Sa at between £10- £20m depending on what you read.
We need at least 1 and possibly 2 new CBs, (3 if Kilman leaves), at least one to be top quality. Yerson may do a job as one of the two but we can't risk him not hitting the ground running, (especially if Dawson isn't back to his best), as the senior new CB.
CM is strong
But we need one or preferably two new forwards - Adams could have been the central one of those (Whilst I don't disagree that Che Adams is not a great player he is a lot better than we currently have as back ups and is on a free. Beggars - and that is practically what we are it seems - can't be choosers! So once again be careful what you wish for.) and a wide player to provide competition to Sarabia as the back up.
Is this the alternative role for Gomes R?. (If he was a LWB I could imagine RAN playing further forwards quite easily and Gomes R slipping in at LWB but can Gomes R play RF as a back up to Neto?)
In other words even if Sa and Kilman stay - in which case we really are coppering up - we need 5 new players beyond Gomes R. It is going to be interesting to see how we cope this (last) summer before the bomb squad "drop off the books" next year and we hopefully return to a far better financial position!
1.) 11 Jun 2024 16:51:04
It remains to be seen how yerson will adapt to the prem Tfg. His disciplinary record on pitch hasn't been too clever in the past, as I recall he was sent off along with podence during the first half on a friendly pre season in spain, and I believe he was also dismissed in the first minutes of a game in the Americas, a little 'reactionary' perhaps?. Last thing we need is a player sitting out for 3 games here and there. That said, I do like the look of the guy from the little I've seen.
2.) 11 Jun 2024 17:18:33
Abbey - do not disagree that it would be foolish to rely too heavily on him. Hence as I stated above we need a leader CB to effectively replace Dawson who surely can't go on to much longer or preferabbly play alogside him for a year whilst Toti matures and we see how good Yerson is.
I'm hopeful Yerson can be at least a squad member next year but as you say it would be a gamble not to buy another established CB who would be expected to start in the first 11 not just be a squad member
3.) 11 Jun 2024 19:59:26
Totally agree Tfg. Reading today we've an interest in olypiakos defender Campra?, or similar name. Apparently he's well regarded.
4.) 12 Jun 2024 15:28:38
Ah TFOG so nice to have a little more common sense round here again buddy!
Won't surprise ya to hear that I agree with pretty much everything you've said on both posts (this one and rumours re:Lemina) ?
We definitely can't afford to lose the few high quality players we have and like you said without Neto we just don't score! Also entirely agree on the need to replace Craig, great player but he's not getting any younger. I think we should have been in for some of these free cbs that have been going but then I also expect those clubs that have got them will be offering HUGE contracts so maybe it's just not realistic for us?
Like you've said if we start the season and haven't signed another cb and another striker then I will be somewhat concerned for our ongoing Prem survival! Eitherway just good to see ya back and posting buddy ?
04 Jun 2024 18:22:27
Some really good and well thought out comments in the threads on this page.
I agree we have to maximize revenues from all sources so it is hard to be too critical of the season ticket price rises but as some on here have already said the reality is that the game is no longer about match day revenues!
Indeed for us it represents less than 10% of our turnover and even if we increase revenues from this source by 10% the entire increase doesn't pay for Fabio over the summer school holidays!
Note despite the substantially bigger stadiums and higher prices the gap between us and the so called big teams in matchday revenues isn't in fact that significant either - Chelsea made £76m and we made £15m
The game now is all about non match day revenues.
Our performance on the pitch to some extent correlates to the TV money you get, being a "fashionable" big team helps as well, but again this is not where we fall down - despite seemingly being happy to walk away from 10 - 15 million plus pa by going on holiday for the last few weeks of the season each year and dropping 4, 5 or 6 places down the league - we actually earnt £125m and Chelsea "only" £225m in the season ending May 2023
No where we are truly falling massively behind is in commercial revenue - we make £26m Chelsea £210m.
Thus for us to compete we need to do 2 things: build commercial revenues and play to the last day of the season.
1.) 04 Jun 2024 19:05:52
Great to see ya back TFG buddy, as always spot on and on point! ?
2.) 05 Jun 2024 06:29:09
TFOG.so right. A decent approach to developing revenue streams outside match day income is desperately needed. We will not be able to compete without that issue being addressed.
3.) 05 Jun 2024 07:27:14
Increasing revenue via external streams. Isn't that Jeff She's prime role now?
4.) 05 Jun 2024 07:44:37
TFOG, very good post.
5.) 05 Jun 2024 08:29:53
Very good to have you posting again TFIG, and how true regarding the end of season place rewards, but we're never truly going to compete with the likes of Chelsea for many reasons, fan base procurement and ground locations etc. Revenue from other 'sourves' all linked to the aforementioned. One area I don't get is sponsorship and connections, for example the DeBet connection for this year, we agreed gambling has got to come off the shirts, but here we are signing up to another anonymous on line company with, I would suggest, little interest being generated at home, sure internationally I assume there a connection but how much are we actually benefitting from that? Surely a larger more recognisable name could be procured. How much did Sure and cruise companies pay for the training shirts. Are adidas/puma/Nike more profitable over castore or Sudu or do they only associate with success? Sponsorship is a very complicated investment I know but Topps Tiles have one of the main focal points in the ground and for what financial gain against a leading food outlet say. Its all a baffling to me except football is what I buy into, the love of my club, I want to talk about the game not the quality of the sandwich I ate at half time, something I believe that as been pointed out before elsewhere! It may be the new way but it also prices out a lot of the clubs foundations, the people that make the club, the people who'll still be there in the echoing stands on the rainy afternoon in the lower leagues when the business folk have deserted.
Surely the two need each other and afford respect to each other accordingly.
6.) 05 Jun 2024 08:58:08
TFOG - is back! Always enjoy your comments as do many on this forum!
7.) 05 Jun 2024 09:49:56
And JD sports are going to be our sleeve sponsor.
29 Jan 2024 16:24:55
-----------It has been posted - stop sending the same thing over and over--------
1.) 29 Jan 2024 17:07:07
On "teams and matches" which very few people read?
Hence only Ken, who I told about the post, has replied?
Why not post on the main thread i.e. this page?
Don't want to be awkward but surely the whole idea of the site is to engender debate, which, as shown by the paucity of replies, is hard if you don't put posts on the main pages?
{Ed002's Note - Because the page is dedicated to information about teams an matches.}
2.) 29 Jan 2024 17:13:55
Sorry TFIOG.
3.) 29 Jan 2024 19:04:57
Loads of my stuff gets put on other posts mate it is up to us as fans to check those other sections such as other posts and teams and matches, clunmping everything on one section would just be a mess and a pain to scroll through.
27 Jan 2024 19:50:20
Allegedly Callum Wilson - who we could have signed in 2014 for just £4m (we resigned Leon Clarke instead?!) - is available for circa £18m as FFP bites Newcastle
Old, (soon to be 32), injury prone and on over £100k a week but v v good?
Whilst I suspect that there will a fairly lengthy line of clubs looking to sign him most of whom are probably ahead of us in the "pecking order" is he worth a look?
Can we afford him under FFP?
Given Otto has gone and Fabio and Sasa are out on loan with at least part of their wages paid we should be able to afford his wages and over a say 4 year contract he would cost £4.5m a year - or just about 2 places in the league which his goals would surely pretty much gtee?
Thoughts?
1.) 27 Jan 2024 20:46:55
If the price was right but only on a 2 year deal with option of 3rd
2.) 27 Jan 2024 21:50:51
We didn't sign him from Coventry because he got injured and was out for a few months. Instead of waiting, we opted for Clarke who was playing well at the time.
3.) 28 Jan 2024 00:09:01
I quite like Callum Wilson but as for signing him at 32 on I would imagine as you say future a 3-4 year contract I don't think it would be a good idea. My reasons why are based on his fitness record and I don't think he has the speed that we are probably looking for and at 32 that's not going any better. Sorry about that but not for me, mind you I'm sure Gary cares not one jot about my opinion!
4.) 28 Jan 2024 06:36:52
Doesn't really fit the young and hungry profile the club seems to prefer and his wages would be problematic, especially if we are in the hunt for a longer (younger) signing who may command a significant wage as well.
5.) 28 Jan 2024 10:03:32
It sounds like Costa the sequel to me. No more than loan until June then one year with an option for one more if the price is right.
6.) 28 Jan 2024 10:20:44
Jas I may well be wrong but wasn''t he also £4m whilst Clarke was avaiable for under £1m?
We probably either didn't have the money or since both were playing v well in a partnership for Coventry misguidely thought that both were equally good?
Bournemouth, who were 1 league below us but for obvious reasons then spent much of the ensuing time above us, took the gamble and the rest is history.
For what its worth I probably would take the undoubted risk now.
He has been injured a lot over the past couple of years but has still scored lots and lots of goals. When he plays he is superb!
For £18m, even if he only plays half a season, he would be a bargain
However 32 and high wages are also red flags so totally understand others views including the v sensible one re squad fit.
Thefutureisoldgold's rumour replies
14 Jul 2024 11:31:03
BB- snap!
Cunha had 19 premier league goal contributions but only played 70% of the time.
Hwang 15 in 60% and Neto 13 in 40%. If, and I accept it is a big if, all 3 had been fit/available all year where would we have ended up? Far higher than we did! So why break up what is obviously a v good thing, (surely better to supplement it - as we have with Larsen and Gomes {R})? Particularly for pennies, cf the prices other teams demand/achieve for their players, (look at the number of totally unproven premier league players moving for double digit millions already this summer and the suggested levels others like Arsenal are seeking for their reserves!)
Note how much money you lose if you get relegated and spend a mere season out of the Prem.
The risk of selling your better players surely isn't worth it?
27 Jun 2024 23:13:29
Bux the info on the new player can be gleaned from the first two articles you get on "google" on him - doesn't take long.
Your underlying point however is correct - we have bought, (will have bought if this chap arrives), 4 players for £50m none of whom will be first choices unless something disasterous happens like we sell one of the better players in the first 11.
But we have an excellent first 11 already (maybe a bit weak at CB, all 3 of then for different reasons and left sided forward, Hwang other than his goal scoring - although given the aim of the game that is pretty important - isn't a good enough footballer), but we had no squad depth.
These youngish players are therefore being bought to boost the squad depth and for the future.
It is not what I would be doing.
I'd be buying/signing battle hardened Prem vets including 2 or 3 who play CB and left sided forward. They would probably be quite a bit older and maybe on higher wages but they would come with an element of a gtee of competence.
Low risk but lower reward especially in the future than maybe these punts carry?
I have also stated several times that I agree with you about the risk of selling the better players - no matter whow many zirconium you have it never matches a diamond - to fund these deals!
That would be truly stupid!
But let's be honest Hobbs has been brilliant (not stupid) over the last year. Recent signings Gomes, Cunha and Lemina are now 3 of our top 5 players.
Consequently I'm happy to give him the benefit of the doubt and say maybe these 3 ( 4 includng Doyle) like his previous signings are going to be somewhat better than Jeffs boys Guedes, Trincao, Fabio and Hoever etc etc
Appreciate your response however!
27 Jun 2024 19:12:21
Statistically he looks ok circa 1 in 4 goals and a handful of assists. Say 12/13 contributions per season. Although I gather he rarely plays the full 90 mins and indeed often is not starting?
A strange situation given that when he actually gets on the pitch his stats are clearly much better at circa 19 contributions per season?
Any ideas why he plays so few minutes despite his output? Not a superstar, (he wouldn't be signing for Wolvesif he was), but quite young and seems to have the physical attributes we are looking for. Obviously I will reserve judgement until I have seen him play - can he run? Price looks ok ish but if we buy him we will have spent circa 50m on 4 players.
Totally understand why we aren't talking about our finances but clearly I'm scared that this means we are just about to do something very stupid like sell one of Neto, Gomes, RAN or Cunha for £40-50m.
I would like us to come out and say our stars are not for sale and that we are building the football club to win but in a financially sustainable way, i.e. we are a well run club! Is that too much to ask?
If however we have to make a sale rather than sell any of of the 5 irreplaceable top 4 quality players we have I would love to see the oft quoted rumour of Sa going to Saudi for £40m be fulfilled and be replaced by the guy from Liverpool for the rumoured circa £15m or Kilman go for a similar if not slightly higher amount and us replace him with a slightly younger Dawson clone - (not sure who mind!) - but definitely a battle hardened Premier league veteran!
Finally in response to some very optimistic earlier posts, I don't see the bomb squad and the assorted kids, including those out on loan elsewhere last year, raising much if anything. Indeed at this stage you might have to pay to get Fabio off the books and Guedes will be hard to shift given his attitude and wages.
Sorry!
08 Jun 2024 17:45:28
BB - I have seen the rumour and believe that yes he is in his last year so the sale price would be at or about his book value.
However it would be madness beyond all madness to sell him at this level or indeed anything up to at least 10x this
If he wasn't in the last year of his contract and 30 you would say he is worth far more than even that. (Arddunby I believe you are correct re prices and that is why I only said 10x the offer)
Alongside Gomes he formed one of the best CM pairs in the league between Sep and Feb (For example they totally outplayed Fernandez and Caicedo at Chelsea who cost nearly £200m more!).
He is undoubtedly one of our top 5 players who are all top 4 quality!
None of them should be sold - Cunha, Neto, RAN and the 2 CMs.
(Accept transfer policy is formed/forced by your financial status and we obviously don't know just how bad it is. However after looking at our historic accounts it is hard to believe that it is now so bad that we are forced to make the self defeating decisions some are sugesting we should/will make)
For many of the fans who assume that we will/should sell Neto be careful what you wish for.
I accept he only played 19 games last year but in those we got 28 points, (and would have had more with VAR playing ball), in the other 19 games we got 18!
In other words with him we are a European football team and a relegation battle side without!
Think about that! How many players can you name that would singlehandedly transform the Forest side into a Champions League team!
That is why all the top sides want him.
If fit he is one of the top handful of players in the league and worth, (if fit ), way more than £60m.
Hopefully we keep him, he reamins fit, and in January if we have to for his sake, (obviously not ours), with enough points on the board to stay up again next year, we can sell him for his true worth - cf Grealish, Caicedo, Fernandez, Anthony etc etc
25 Jan 2024 15:12:48
The young lad from Ipswich - Chirewa (sp) also looked completely comfortable albeit for only a few minutes at the end of the game.
Since GON brought him on one can only assume he is confident in him as well?
Thefutureisoldgold's banter replies
22 Jul 2024 16:03:12
Wandering - last year we made £26m from everything Korea, Mexico, Portugal, India, New Zealand, Mongolia, USA, you name it and Wolverhampton! So whilst i don't have the details I would imagine the numbers you are talking about are miniscule.
But I guess as the advert says "every little helps" and maybe going forwards it will be different it needs to be!
22 Jul 2024 15:19:08
Fordhouse - agree! The last 18 months or so have seen a real turnaround! Hence as I stated in a post a few days ago I am reasonably positive we can look up not down fom last season.
Subject of course to buying a new CB and not selling any of our best players!
Goatmark - Wolves accounts, which are publicy available. Yes we do have a modest wage bill for the football side but sadly not for something else - I don't know what!
Bux - yes re Trincao, Jose and Hoever. Not sure about the squad size. Nuno stated he wanted a bigger squad after Seville so they sold Jota to partially finance the purchase of Fabio and Hoever!
19 Jul 2024 23:03:52
Grey I am not sure if are you being serious?
If they joined our current squad I don't see any of them making the first team and thus obviously are worth nothing like £80m?
Smith Rowe whilst extremely promising 3 years ago has barely played over the last two years and seems to have lost his way and Nelson similarly is in his mid 20s has also barely played in the Prem and produces modest results when he does. Eddie N on the other is I accept a genuine prospect (although also in his mid 20s!) and worth looking at but he is not in the same bracket as Neto (or Cunha) who is a game changer at Prem league level now.
Whilst I wouldn't willingly do the deal if Neto was forcing the move to Arseanl and this was the "only offer" I would want £30m, £40m or even £50m plus the 3 for Neto. I also fear that their wages would be stupidly high for squad players!
Neto surely should be viewed in line with the other top players in the Prem as, (other than ironically at Arsenal were Saka probably would hold him put of the team and at Liverpool where Salah at least for the next season or so would as well), he would not just walk into the first 11s of most sides he would be amongst their better players, (might be best at Spurs and in arguement at Man U and Chelsea)
Is he not a class above Anthony or Mudryk or Grealish or Richarlison etc etc?
19 Jul 2024 22:24:41
Nigel I saw that as well and of course we are also one of the favourites with the bookies to go down, 6th favourite on the site I saw at 4-1.
However as Abby said surely it is too early to make such judgements as we don't even know the squads which will be competing for the various sides.
Whilst we have a terrible start with fixtures and may struggle over the first few weeks they unwind of course and so we shouldn't read too much into that factor.
Before the summer I was reasonably confident we would do at least as well next season as last and so far our window has been "ok", if a bit of a curate's egg.
Obviously good adding depth and potential with new signings and the return of Yerson, but bad with the so far unreplaced loss of our captain and a first choice CB, Kilman and the ageing and injury of our best CB Dawson. Particularly as CB was the area we were probably weakest in even before the summer.
Last year we conceded too many and the loss of Kilman and potentially Dawson means, (unless he/they is/are replaced), we will probably concede more. But we scored freely with Cunha and Neto being high class players.
Consequently unless we do something very "brave", like selling Neto - although I saw you, hopefully joking, suggesting that we should swap him for 3 Arsenal reserves who probably would also sit on the end of our bench - we should be fine.
If we are able to sign a battle hardened prem experienced CB to replace Kilman then I would be very confident we should be looking upwards not down from last year
But we have been on a steady decline over the past 3 years, 10th, 13th and 14th and as shown by our last 10 or so games last season when we were without Neto and accumulated barely a point we are extremely vulnerable.
The gap between say 8/9/10th and relegation is not anywhere near as wide as you might think a few bad decisions, a bit of bad luck, an injury or two etc could send any team in the bottom half into a relegation battle but of course that can go the other way as well. We might not have so many bad decisions go against us, get some hugely over due good luck and not suffer with so many injuries to key players, (note we have added some depth now so perhaps aren't quite as vulnerable as before), so might as I said be looking upwards, even from 8/9th!
But let's wait and see how things look in a couple of weeks or so before getting too concerned.
08 Jul 2024 13:04:56
Odd question E?.
Surely the answer is obvious, Fosun are not a charity and therefore Wolves will be expected to generate a return for them on the investment they have made.
Fortunately for us though the only way Wolves make a return, (indeed don't lose all of the money that Fosun have already invested), for Fosun is by them being successful
Clearly over the period of the Fosun ownership Wolves have lost millions through the P and L but at the moment it has probably made at least as much if not more in capital appreciation.
All of that capital appreciation disappears overnight however if Wolves are relegated and it is highly likely that underlying losses may also increase as revenue plummets far faster than costs can be brought down.
The disastrous period post Seville, which has caused both the financial and on field performance to stall, has almost washed through.
Next year Silva will leave and Guedes will probably be amortised to a level he can be sold at without a loss. Consequently we should be able to stabilise the finances and continue to build in a sustainable way the on field performance.
It merely requires us to not do anything stupid and short termist this summer and going forwards we can re-emerge from the debacle we have endured due to foolish decisions made post Seville when perhaps Fosun didn't fully understand how the game works. Their actions over the last couple of years indicate that maybe they now do?